CP040 vs GP340?

[MotoNut]

Wondering what the big difference is between the two radios in terms of performance?

I have 6 CP040 UHF and tested them all over the weekend for a 2 day period. I wasn't overly impressed with battery or performance and didn't see them as being any better than previously owned 446 radios, when considering there are 8 times more powerful. In fact the 446 Radios I had lasted just as long in batteries with a 700mAh and had a Roger Beep which made things easier to distinguish when someone had finished talking.

Whilst driving and using the units the CP040s often got some interference. Is this normal as I didn't get this with my 446s.

I also used them in the Hotel and also got a fair bit of interference at times.

Questions

1. Would a VHF radio suit me better and still work ok it a hotel or through buildings, long distance road.

2. Would a GP340 perform better than a CP040. Cost isn't an issue here. I just want the best radio option for my needs and to still be able to use an earpiece that is compatible.

3. Would the 3 frequency that has been programmed make the radio perform any different?

[Andreas GH]

The CP040 is not a very good radio.The receiver performance isn´t good.
GP3xx have a much better receiver performance.
You shouldn´t program a radio with the maximun of TX power,if you need a long lasting battery.
The double power output means not a double distance!
1-2,5W ist the best.

Andreas

[lixa]

In theory VHF should give you a better range.

If you're using 'shared' frequencies, you can avoid interference by programming CTCSS/PL.

[MotoNut]

Thanks for the above comments peps.
Is the GP series that much better and worth parting my CP040s?

Are they the same size as I have a peli case that fits all radios upright and only just fit?

[bw18]

Hi Motunut,

Yes the GP series is a better all round radio. It has 5tone capability, which when used to its full potential is fantastic (PTT i.d, de-key/roger bleep etc).

The CP series is slightly smaller than the GP's, but if you have a pick & pluck style Peli case this should be fine.

With regards to VHF/UHF it really depends where you will be using the radios for the majority of their usage. If you are mainly outdoors then VHF is the way to go, if you are mainly indoors then UHF would be better. So its a balancing act as to where the radios are used most.

The other alternative is TRBO. The GP series is still active in production, however with TRBO you have the option of analogue and digital. Slowly the GP series will be retired as more and more businesses make the switch to digital. Lith-Ion batteries are a must though, not only for TRBO, but pretty much any radio that is going to be used for a long duration with little/no charging. Also its worth considering there is a very small cost difference between GP & TRBO- if cost is not an issue I know where I would be spending my money!

With regards to interference this is something you will experience when using a portable in a car. If you have a fleet of vehicles that you use constantly it would be worth considering installing mobile radios into the vehicles with a fixed roof aerial... Or installing a fixed aerial with an adaptor to fit into your portable radios.


BW

[MotoNut]

HI BW,

Thanks for the reply and taking the time to explain.

Yes I have a 1520 Peli with Pick n Pluck and if I decide to part the CP040s out I would want to make sure the GP fits in their place without buying a new case. The CP040s just fit and wondered how much taller the GP340s are?? Pic to show...




In regards to VHF/ UHF. Yes they are used outdoors 95% of time. I just wondered if VHF would still go through trees etc. Still better then a UHF CP series?

What is a 446 radio set up as UHF or VHF as I find they work perfect but just lack range. Hence why a pro radio is taking its place.

The other concern with battery is if a 5watt VHF GP is used how much more power/ battery is going to be drained. Am I going to need to carry 2-3 spares around with each radio per day?

http://www.roadphone.co.uk/mdh25rdc9an3ae.htm Here they offer 2 li-ion Batteries, An 1800 & 2000 mAh. Would something like this last a whole day of using? or is a second spare battery needed?

I have never come across a TRBO GP340 but analogue is still fine for me and price im sure is quite different.

A handheld radio is still key for us to use, not installing a fixed aerial in the cars. Great suggestion, I know that would be the best solution but they are not the type of vehicles we want big aerials stuck to.

[bw18]

Hi Motonut,

With a lith-ion battery the GP series is a thinner radio, it is slightly taller but as you are removing aerials anyway this shouldn't be a problem. I would be going for a 2000/2200 mAH battery for all day usage, it's worth bearing in mind that the calculation used for battery life is generally- 90% standby, 5% TX, 5% RX.

Unless you are quite literally talking all day long a lith-ion battery should be fine. It is however good practice to carry a spare battery for each radio.

446 is the UK's license free consumer radio. No licenses, no programming and no guarantee of no interference! Also with a restriction of 500mw TX power! Great for kids and holidaying, but pretty poor when it comes to professional usage. 446 is UHF.

TRBO is a totally different range... DP3400 & DP3600 are the portables. There are options for GPS also. Great at the moment for privacy as there is not a scanner on the market able to decode digital transmissions.

VHF would be the way to go in your case. When you hit concrete is when you will see the advantage of UHF, but for 95% outdoor usage I would be going VHF.

With regards to using portables in cars... Without having an aerial on the roof you are going to suffer from poor RX & TX, electrical harmonics of the car and the fact you are in the middle of a very well insulated tin can doesn't lend itself very well to letting radio waves in and out lol! 

Just one more thought. You could ask your dealer to programme one of the side buttons with High/Low power. When you are working close to each other you can drop down to low power, obvisouly when you are working further apart you can increase the power to High. This will save you a fair bit of battery aslong as all users do the same!

[MotoNut]

Thanks again.
The max I see is an 2000mAh. part number HNN4003
I have 2x Brand new radio at the mo (CP040) with New Lithium batteries and they certainly last longer over the other 4, but they are second hand/ Nickel the others and probably dying! They didn't last as long as I hoped we beeping on me for a while whilst trying to talk, In the end I could only listen in on others conversations. I did have on Low power, but then had to up it as I was loosing them and it was very clear even close proximity in the cars whilst driving. I can only think the GP will drain more power than the CP being 5 watts.

I had a quick research on mototrbo and found what you were talking about.

Found these 6x DP3400. These any good or a little overkill for what I need? Will these work better through concrete, in cars and better range than analogue? I know the sound will be better.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250899777572&category=4674&_trksid=p5197.c0.m619

Would these be VHF (does say). Im guessing they are based on the Large Aerials.
Again Re: Aerials, would a 9cm work just as well on a VHF as I would prefer a shorter one?

TIA BW, your info is invaluable!!

[bw18]

I have those on 'watch' on eBay too... Not to buy, just to see how much they eventually go for!

I am guessing they are VHF due to the size of the aerials (beasts!!!)... Yes you could put a smaller aerial on if required, but remember the longer/higher the aerial the better your coverage will be- generally.

There are so many different radios out there, all of which have a pros and cons. TRBO is very good, even on the edge of coverage the audio quality is good with no background static, however, it can start to sound like a drunken dalek when they are pushed to the limits- coverage wise. They do take some getting use to and some people don't like it! Now I would'nt go back to analogue but it did take me a while to get use to it.

The whole 'range' problem can only really be made better by using a repeater (or be on flat unobstructed ground). 1-2 miles is a realisitic figure to work on in built up areas using a simplex (back-to-back) system. 2-4 miles is realisitic when in an open area with no hills or buildings. You can pump out 25 watts, but this does not mean you will increase your range that much... It's all about aerial installation, location, type- beam, yagi etc. For covering a space that is confined- i.e. a shopping centre you want an umbrella affect that showers the complex downwards and all the way around. It is a complicated business and however simple it all seems to pick up a radio, turn it on and talk there will have been a lot of thought gone into making the system work as well as it does!

I don't personally think DP3400's are overkill for what you do, however you have not told us exactly what you use the radios for, I could probably take a good guess though 

There is also a GP330, this is the same as the 340, but with 4 channels. If you don't plan to use all 16 channels on the 340 then save yourself a few quid and go for the 330. Or, splash out and go for the TRBO, then you have analogue and digital!

BW

[MotoNut]

Interesting..

I wont be really using the radios till next year now due to race season coming to an end.
I dont use the radios for commercial or business use. Its just a way of keeping in touch for holiday driving abroad, convoys/ general talking for long journeys to keep you occupied and locating each other when parting during the day, built of of hills and trees mainly and the odd building. But then when we hit town I would hope for them to work too.

Without trying a VHF radio I am unaware of their capability. Like the CP040 I had to buy before I could test and my first test way last month, which in all honesty, my previous 446 radios seemed to cope just as well for £50-£100 for a set of 4 (Midland GXT600). Now they have a GTX1000 which I was tempted at, says they are 5 watts? How can this be right??

To be honest I am sure I managed to set the power from Low to High, but this is if the button has been programmed Right? The top button gives off a SSSHHHH and bottom button bleeps once then twice if pushed again. Not sure what holding it down does but it gives a different lower tone beep?? and then gones into other beeps (set of 3). Not much is mentioned in the manual to explain!

4 channels if fine for me but not a single GP330 on eBay, tonnes of GP340s thou. I only run 3 channels anyway at the moment as a dealer set me up on 3 that he said would be fine to use without interrupting others. I recently asked and made note of the 3 he put me on if it interests you.

[bw18]

Might be worth speaking to your local dealer and asking if you can hire a couple of VHF radios to test for a day, atleast that way you will get a good idea.

I have never seen 446 radios with 5W output... That sounds American to me!

The top button you describe is the 'monitor' button. This basically opens the squelch and allows you to listen to any traffic on the channel (useful if you are using CTCSS and want to see if there is someone on the same frequency as you, but on a different tone). Sounds like the lower button is High/Low power and the 3 beeps are VOX sensitivity settings.

449.3125MHz, 449.4000MHz, 449.4750MHz would be my lucky guess for the frequncies that have been programmed to your radios!

GP330's replaced the GP320 which were a single channel radio, they are fairly new so I am not suprised there are not any on eBay!

[MotoNut]

American alright! Haha... and A range of..Wait for it.... 50km (36miles)  

Yea I guessed top button would have been squelch but wasnt sure if it was working and how it works tbh, it was just giving me a load of noise!

Bottom button seems to be programed to hi & low like you say as it gives me the 2 different beeps which indicates in the manual as power levels. However when you hold it for a couple of secs it sounds like its some sort of test tone (LOUD) and beeps whenever you adjust/ push something on the radio. To test all functions are operating correctly or volume test?

Lucky guess on the frequencies or not, im guessing their common ones to use?? How did you guess?

Seem to be a few more to choose from for VHF. Low, Mid & High. What are the differences here?

[bw18]

Classic American advertising... Not impossible by any means, but you would need some VERY flat ground!

There are several settings that the long press lower button can activate... I've just had a look on the CP/CM CPS and there is more than I thought! If your dealer has saved your codeplug you could ask them to e-mail the 'report' over. Just ask for the report from the CPS, they will know what you mean. This will tell you everything about the radio, settings, frequencies etc.

The frequencies are 'UK Simple', probably called something different by now as OFCOM like to re-name everything on a regular basis. Each band has a small selection of frequencies that can be used accross the UK. Really great idea, apart from LOTS of people use them... These is where you need CTCSS enabled! Its also the cheapest way to license radios and 'be legal'.

Have a look at George's post, its is a really good guide to how things work: http://forum.motorola-radio-support.co.uk/index.php/topic,1154.msg4183.html#msg4183


 

[MotoNut]

Cheers BW. Sound like a good idea if my dealer are able to send me a report over of the programming. Will fire them over an email.

Will have a read of the thread you enclosed. Ta

[MotoNut]

One thing I did notice about the GP series is the headset connector is completely different to my current CP040s. Whats the reason for this? Will a 2 pin not fit directly in?